1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by sincitygpw » Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:14 pm

Hi Greg
Thanks for your reply! I deserve a good a good "Flogging" for my misread... :) It could not have been frosty pops and cuervo :shock: Nobody's fault but mine! :lol:
Thank's Again
Dave


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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by d42jeep » Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:37 pm

My Union marked Red Devil P1-1¼S looks just like your Irvington marked example with just two large rivets holding it together. I've only seen the small pins on other (and I assume earlier) Irvington marked knives.
-Don
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Red Devil P1-1¼S Union, NJ marked
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Ford GPW 76344 DOD 11/42 Built in Richmond, CA

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by sincitygpw » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:42 pm

Hi Don
On my Union marked blade it has two big rivets and one small rivet,just like the one mudbox posted on page one of this thread, I noticed your Union marked blade does not have this pin on it. From what I can see.Just want to find out when this change took place? Any idea? Post war improvement further down the line? Has this been discussed before?
Thanks Again
Dave

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by d42jeep » Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:41 pm

Hi Dave,
I assume the pin that you are referring to is in what Wingnutt refers to as a bolster. I can see it clearly in the knife that Jason posted at the beginning of the thread although I can't see it in your knife. I do not believe that it has been discussed before and it is probably there just to retain the bolster. I think that I might have an unmarked knife with that feature as well. I have no idea if it is a newer or older design feature although I don't see it in my more modern knives.
-Don
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Pin through bolster
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IMG_4747.JPG
Modern knives
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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by sincitygpw » Tue Jun 27, 2017 6:26 pm

Hi Don
If I am not mistaken I believe that the bolster is on the back part of the knife so if it would drop from 8' foot, that is what would protect the end from shattering.Sorry for so many questions. Then again thanks for bearing with me.
Thanks
Dave

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by sincitygpw » Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:02 pm

Hi Don
3 more to the right is what I believe is what Greg said is a bolster. please correct me if I am wrong.Not trying to stir the pot in any way just looking for some answers.
Thanks Again
Dave

Don
I have not posted pictures of my Union marked blade that is why I said it is like the one posted by Mud box.
No disrespect in any way!
Thanks
Dave

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by henry501 » Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:41 pm

Guys,

The bolster is the metal piece at the front of the wooden handle.

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Henry

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by mudbox » Wed Jun 28, 2017 4:48 am

I'm not sure why we're spinning wheels on a post war (Union NJ) putty knife, but for continuity and discussion I'll repost my Red Devil knife here. It's missing the rivet at the back of the handle. FWIW, I don't think the handle is made of cocobolo wood.

Image

-Jason

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by sincitygpw » Wed Jun 28, 2017 5:32 am

Hi Don
Now I know what the bolster is, I had that mixed up with what you said was a reinforcement plate on the back of one of your knives made from brass that you and Greg were discussing now I know the terminology. My Union marked knife has the pin on the bolster,my Irvington does not.Your Union marked knife that you posted does not have a pin on the bolster.I was trying to find out when and why they started putting the pins on the bolsters? I know I ask a lot of questions! Even though they are post war just an observation.
Thanks Again
Dave

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by sincitygpw » Wed Jun 28, 2017 5:38 am

Hi Henry
Thanks for setting me straight on the bolster!
Thanks
Dave

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by sincitygpw » Wed Jun 28, 2017 5:48 am

Hi Jason
Even though they are post war I was just curious .Did you know before that they were post war or just recently?
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Dave

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by mudbox » Wed Jun 28, 2017 5:58 am

sincitygpw wrote:Did you know before that they were post war or just recently?
I had a suspicion about the one that I have being post war. I did not have any definitive information until recently. With all the Red Devil knives across the various kits, I was looking for something unique/different to put into my kit. Regardless, I pick up just about every vintage branded 1-1/4" putty knife that I find at the flea. Just in case another verified manufacturer is brought to light. 8)
-Jason

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by Wingnutt » Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:27 am

d42jeep wrote:I assume the pin that you are referring to is in what Wingnutt refers to as a bolster.
Just to clarify, it is referred to as a bolster in catalogs as well as the 1939 Fed Specs, which specify a "bolster at the front end of the handle." While some of the wartime references show a putty knife without a bolster (see my notes above), the figures in the Fed Specs and ORD 6 have bolsters. Collectors might use the figures without a bolster to justify no bolster, but I don't trust it, personally. That's just me.

As long as we're on terminology, why are you guys referring to some of the hardware holding the handle to the tang of the blade as a pin? Some of the putty knives we see in manuals, as well as those found, have larger heads than others, but aren't they all rivets? And while I'm on that subject and the question about the number of them, the wartime references show figures with two (2) and three (3) rivets, sometimes in the same manual, and the 1939 Fed Specs specify a "sufficient quantity of rivets, securely headed." So the jury is definitely out on number of rivets in my opinion.
mudbox wrote:Just in case another verified manufacturer is brought to light.
My 1944 Heyle & Coyle hardware catalog has Russell putty knives in the correct size, marked Russell on the blade. One large rivet, two small rivets, in that order down the handle. The handle is advertised as beech. A Russell scraping knife with a much wider blade was cocobolo. And there is a Russell in the CPA MWSC books, but contracts for "HARDWARE," not tools. Very iffy in my opinion.
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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by sincitygpw » Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:28 am

Hi Jason
Right On! There is too many cool tools out there to pass up.All you Big Dogs have a lot of knowledge I am just a novice with a lot of questions.I may be wrong about things I say but at least I can admit it!
Thanks Again
Dave

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Re: 1939 Fed Specs: Putty Knife (41-K-546)

Post by d42jeep » Wed Jun 28, 2017 7:16 am

I just referred to them as pins to differentiate them from the large headed rivets. Of course they are actually all rivets of different sizes and appearances. I'll have to check. I think I may have one of the Russell knives. :shock:
-Don
Ford GPW 76344 DOD 11/42 Built in Richmond, CA


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