Hotchkiss VS MB body tub differences?
-
- G-Major General
- Posts: 2570
- Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:54 am
- Location: Colorado
- Contact:
Hotchkiss VS MB body tub differences?
Can someone tell me (roughly) the differences in a M201 tub and a true WW2 MB tub?
I mean, the obviuos difference I have read were the cowl to dash "lip" is narrower on the Hotch and NO notch. I can see this diffence comparing close up dash photographs.
what about the toe board supports on the inside?
Is there a difference with the supports with like 2-3" diameter holes in them on the U.S. made trucks vs the Hotchkiss has NO holes?
Anything else to look for?
i am asking because I was told some imported Hotchkiss jeeps were actually a combination of, or even mostly U.S. jeep parts, including the body tubs.
Anything else I could look for to distiquish the bodies apart?
I know the Hotch bodies (or at least some) had a serial number stamped on the firewall above the fuel filter.
Were all Hotch jeep tubs stamped here?
thanks all!!
I mean, the obviuos difference I have read were the cowl to dash "lip" is narrower on the Hotch and NO notch. I can see this diffence comparing close up dash photographs.
what about the toe board supports on the inside?
Is there a difference with the supports with like 2-3" diameter holes in them on the U.S. made trucks vs the Hotchkiss has NO holes?
Anything else to look for?
i am asking because I was told some imported Hotchkiss jeeps were actually a combination of, or even mostly U.S. jeep parts, including the body tubs.
Anything else I could look for to distiquish the bodies apart?
I know the Hotch bodies (or at least some) had a serial number stamped on the firewall above the fuel filter.
Were all Hotch jeep tubs stamped here?
thanks all!!
- lucakiki
- G-General
- Posts: 17578
- Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2003 7:18 am
- Location: Torino, ITALY
A super quick one: no sidescreen/half door buttons sing a French sounding bell.
As for toeboard gussets, the French ones are very different both from Early Willys and from Composite bodied tubs. All have holes, but the french have a peculiar pattern.
Have a look here: http://www.nserv.it/imvcc/viewtopic.php?t=337
It is in Italian, but the red arrows on the pictures are in english.
As for toeboard gussets, the French ones are very different both from Early Willys and from Composite bodied tubs. All have holes, but the french have a peculiar pattern.
Have a look here: http://www.nserv.it/imvcc/viewtopic.php?t=337
It is in Italian, but the red arrows on the pictures are in english.
Luca
WillysMB#344142 6-19-44 Navy N.S.Blue Grey
45 Bantam T-3 #57248 1-10-45
42 Willys MB-T #13560 11-42
43 Willys MB-T # 25417 4-43
Way too many WWII military tools,hopefully thinning down,and way too many posts...
__________________________________________
_____________________________________________
__________________________________________
WillysMB#344142 6-19-44 Navy N.S.Blue Grey
45 Bantam T-3 #57248 1-10-45
42 Willys MB-T #13560 11-42
43 Willys MB-T # 25417 4-43
Way too many WWII military tools,hopefully thinning down,and way too many posts...
__________________________________________
_____________________________________________
__________________________________________
- Mr_Flibble
- Sergeant Major of the Gee
- Posts: 407
- Joined: Thu Aug 24, 2006 11:44 am
- Location: The Lowlands
- Contact:
Here's site with some pictures that might help:
http://carrsite2.mysite.wanadoo-members ... 201mb1.htm
http://carrsite2.mysite.wanadoo-members ... 201mb1.htm
Rick
1943 - Willys MB - #221863 1A-165SPC * PHOTO-3
1943 - Willys MB - #221863 1A-165SPC * PHOTO-3
-
- G-Major General
- Posts: 2570
- Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:54 am
- Location: Colorado
- Contact:
thanks...
Thanks Mr. Fribble for that web site!
Outstanding.
I am learning more about my newly purchased Hotchkiss
Seems it was built on a true WW2 wartime MB chassis though, as it has the MB date plate riveted to the frame where it should be.
Funny thing , though, it has the added stiffening "U" channels near the front frame horn like a Hotchkiss frame does.
An upgrade during a rebuild perhaps?
Outstanding.
I am learning more about my newly purchased Hotchkiss
Seems it was built on a true WW2 wartime MB chassis though, as it has the MB date plate riveted to the frame where it should be.
Funny thing , though, it has the added stiffening "U" channels near the front frame horn like a Hotchkiss frame does.
An upgrade during a rebuild perhaps?
-
- G-Major General
- Posts: 2570
- Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:54 am
- Location: Colorado
- Contact:
thanks...
Thanks Mr. Fribble for that web site!
Outstanding.
I am learning more about my newly purchased Hotchkiss
Seems it was built on a true WW2 wartime MB chassis though, as it has the MB date plate riveted to the frame where it should be.
Funny thing , though, it has the added stiffening "U" channels near the front frame horn like a Hotchkiss frame does.
An upgrade during a rebuild perhaps?
Outstanding.
I am learning more about my newly purchased Hotchkiss
Seems it was built on a true WW2 wartime MB chassis though, as it has the MB date plate riveted to the frame where it should be.
Funny thing , though, it has the added stiffening "U" channels near the front frame horn like a Hotchkiss frame does.
An upgrade during a rebuild perhaps?
- Mr_Flibble
- Sergeant Major of the Gee
- Posts: 407
- Joined: Thu Aug 24, 2006 11:44 am
- Location: The Lowlands
- Contact:
The guy who sold mine to me said the chassis was original WW2 too, but I think he removed the U-channels himself and welded a couple of tow-rings on the front horns, right over the spot where the Hotchkiss chassis number would be and then hammered in his own chassis number on the front right ...he forgot to change the other chassis number on the driverside of the frame, in the engine compartment...
I can't find any other French army markings on the chassis though.
Not that it mattered to me at that point, the price was still right.
I can't find any other French army markings on the chassis though.
Not that it mattered to me at that point, the price was still right.
Rick
1943 - Willys MB - #221863 1A-165SPC * PHOTO-3
1943 - Willys MB - #221863 1A-165SPC * PHOTO-3
-
- G-Major General
- Posts: 2570
- Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:54 am
- Location: Colorado
- Contact:
well.
Hi again,
well, the data plate is rivited as original where a MB oval frame plate ought to be.
Looks likes its been there for a very long time!
I cant read the numbers however. ???
I cant find any indication of ground down, welded over, hammered or any other sign of French seril numbers being removed from locations where French frames had them.. anywhere, so I assume this frame is a true WW2 MB.
Unless someone can tell me another way to distiguish the frames apart?
Like I said it does have the "U" channel welded in, but couldnt this have been added to an origianl frame?
Well, like yourself, the price was right, the jeep is very very nice all around, and I am happy with it. I could care less if its part U.S. jeep, part Hotch, 100% either or whatever!
I like it so far!!
Like
well, the data plate is rivited as original where a MB oval frame plate ought to be.
Looks likes its been there for a very long time!
I cant read the numbers however. ???
I cant find any indication of ground down, welded over, hammered or any other sign of French seril numbers being removed from locations where French frames had them.. anywhere, so I assume this frame is a true WW2 MB.
Unless someone can tell me another way to distiguish the frames apart?
Like I said it does have the "U" channel welded in, but couldnt this have been added to an origianl frame?
Well, like yourself, the price was right, the jeep is very very nice all around, and I am happy with it. I could care less if its part U.S. jeep, part Hotch, 100% either or whatever!
I like it so far!!
Like
-
- G-Major General
- Posts: 2570
- Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:54 am
- Location: Colorado
- Contact:
well.
Hi again,
well, the data plate is rivited as original where a MB oval frame plate ought to be.
Looks likes its been there for a very long time!
I cant read the numbers however. ???
I cant find any indication of ground down, welded over, hammered or any other sign of French seril numbers being removed from locations where French frames had them.. anywhere, so I assume this frame is a true WW2 MB.
Unless someone can tell me another way to distiguish the frames apart?
Like I said it does have the "U" channel welded in, but couldnt this have been added to an origianl frame?
Well, like yourself, the price was right, the jeep is very very nice all around, and I am happy with it. I could care less if its part U.S. jeep, part Hotch, 100% either or whatever!
I like it so far!!
Like
well, the data plate is rivited as original where a MB oval frame plate ought to be.
Looks likes its been there for a very long time!
I cant read the numbers however. ???
I cant find any indication of ground down, welded over, hammered or any other sign of French seril numbers being removed from locations where French frames had them.. anywhere, so I assume this frame is a true WW2 MB.
Unless someone can tell me another way to distiguish the frames apart?
Like I said it does have the "U" channel welded in, but couldnt this have been added to an origianl frame?
Well, like yourself, the price was right, the jeep is very very nice all around, and I am happy with it. I could care less if its part U.S. jeep, part Hotch, 100% either or whatever!
I like it so far!!
Like
- lucakiki
- G-General
- Posts: 17578
- Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2003 7:18 am
- Location: Torino, ITALY
No kidding
There is a way, but not exactly easy : strip the whole jeep, and put the frame on a scale. Then get hold of an original U.S. made frame. If the weigh is roughly the same, your frame is also american. If your frame is noticeably heavier, it is French.wc56daveyboy wrote: Unless someone can tell me another way to distiguish the frames apart?
Luca
WillysMB#344142 6-19-44 Navy N.S.Blue Grey
45 Bantam T-3 #57248 1-10-45
42 Willys MB-T #13560 11-42
43 Willys MB-T # 25417 4-43
Way too many WWII military tools,hopefully thinning down,and way too many posts...
__________________________________________
_____________________________________________
__________________________________________
WillysMB#344142 6-19-44 Navy N.S.Blue Grey
45 Bantam T-3 #57248 1-10-45
42 Willys MB-T #13560 11-42
43 Willys MB-T # 25417 4-43
Way too many WWII military tools,hopefully thinning down,and way too many posts...
__________________________________________
_____________________________________________
__________________________________________
- MB MAGIC
- Sergeant Major of the Gee
- Posts: 317
- Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2003 1:56 pm
- Location: EIRE & ENGLAND & TEXAS USA
Hotchkiss Toeboard Gusset Photos
Hello Gang,
wc56daveyboy,
Here are a couple of photos of the toeboard gussets from a Hotchkiss Jeep tub i am selling at this time, i thought
i would show them here before the tub is sold, Luca is correct (as usual ) they are completely different from the
Willys MB and Ford GPW body tub Gussets, as can be clearly seen.
It's MAGIC
wc56daveyboy,
Here are a couple of photos of the toeboard gussets from a Hotchkiss Jeep tub i am selling at this time, i thought
i would show them here before the tub is sold, Luca is correct (as usual ) they are completely different from the
Willys MB and Ford GPW body tub Gussets, as can be clearly seen.
It's MAGIC
-
- G-Major General
- Posts: 2570
- Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:54 am
- Location: Colorado
- Contact:
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 39 guests