sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
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sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
As the subject line goes when was the swap over for the internal parking brake? My sept 44 mb had an internal on it when I got it but it also had the wrong tcase and trans also. So I can't go by that. (the crossmember had to be replaced when I swapped back)
the internal brake has never worked all that well, I have a new set of linings I can put on but if the external is correct I will start to look for the parts.
the internal brake has never worked all that well, I have a new set of linings I can put on but if the external is correct I will start to look for the parts.
Thanks,
Glenn and the 44 MB 372406 "fighting Francis"
(for my dad RIP USMC korea Vet)
Glenn Loud
Western Mass USA
Glenn and the 44 MB 372406 "fighting Francis"
(for my dad RIP USMC korea Vet)
Glenn Loud
Western Mass USA
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
September of '44 would have been factory internal brake. My Nabholtz (reference) is at the house but I believe the change was early June of '44 as I recall.
Jeff Q.
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Jeff Q.
AZ
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
John Farley shows the change from external to internal in "The Standardised Wartime Jeep II", p.127 July 1944.
Gustl
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
Thanks guys that saves me some money then! Just have to pull it off and redo the shoes then. Thanks
Thanks,
Glenn and the 44 MB 372406 "fighting Francis"
(for my dad RIP USMC korea Vet)
Glenn Loud
Western Mass USA
Glenn and the 44 MB 372406 "fighting Francis"
(for my dad RIP USMC korea Vet)
Glenn Loud
Western Mass USA
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
Hoping someone is still following this post. I have a 42 GPW that came with no parking brake. We've disassembled the TCase for a rebuild. Lots of Ford marked bolts and the TCase is F marked. Attached is a picture of the TCase housing, retainer and yoke. I know that the correct e-brake should be "external" but I have a very nice "internal" e-brake (original) and I'm looking at the retaininer thinking I have a "internal" e-brake retainer. I'd appreciate some confirmation on my assessment. I've seen other posts that say the "internal" e-brake is better and quite frankly, I'm not doing this to show in a competition, but to use for historical displays, parades, educational events, etc. I have a feeling my "Baby" went through a few changes, as she also has a large mouth gas tank seat pan.
Anyway, if someone could confirm that I have the retainer for a "internal" type e-brake, I can get the linkage parts to hook it all back up.
Thanks in advance!
Andy
Anyway, if someone could confirm that I have the retainer for a "internal" type e-brake, I can get the linkage parts to hook it all back up.
Thanks in advance!
Andy
Andy Peitsch
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- lucakiki
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
Andy, for sure an internal expanding brake is not original to your 42 GPW and in my very limited knowledge I would say is not original to any GPW.
I think you can anyway assemble your GPW with the internal set-up,if you have enough parts to make it worth to look for the missing parts to complete it.
I think you can anyway assemble your GPW with the internal set-up,if you have enough parts to make it worth to look for the missing parts to complete it.
Luca
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42 Willys MB-T #13560 11-42
43 Willys MB-T # 25417 4-43
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
The late Parking Brake appeared on MB after July 1944, there are many late July 44 MB's with the early parking brake. My DOD 31 July 44 Serial 356378 has the small brake. Nabholtz indicates that 1945 GPW Jeeps did have the large parking brake.
If you can find a CJ-2A thru CJ-5 Parking Brake Assembly to remove, you will have most of what you need. The GPW Skid Plate for the late brake has a unique shape at the rear for the drum.
If you can find a CJ-2A thru CJ-5 Parking Brake Assembly to remove, you will have most of what you need. The GPW Skid Plate for the late brake has a unique shape at the rear for the drum.
Last edited by Joe Gopan on Tue Sep 25, 2012 5:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
Andy:
The retainer you are showing seems to be an internal.
Compare with my internal (WOF):
The retainer you are showing seems to be an internal.
Compare with my internal (WOF):
Gustl
43 MB in restoration, Braden Capstan Winch
44 MB/GPW salad, 53 Maltourneé rebuilt ITM0037090
some Bantam T3 trailers (ex Austrian Army in 2010)
My Youtube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/g503gustl?feature=mhee" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
43 MB in restoration, Braden Capstan Winch
44 MB/GPW salad, 53 Maltourneé rebuilt ITM0037090
some Bantam T3 trailers (ex Austrian Army in 2010)
My Youtube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/g503gustl?feature=mhee" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
I know of six '45 GPWs, all unrestored, that have the external brake.
I believe Tom W. can confirm all late GPWs came thus.
Ed
I believe Tom W. can confirm all late GPWs came thus.
Ed
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
All,
Thanks, this is great info. I'd be curious on Tom W's response. I'm wondering if during the "reconditioning" process by Moore Equpiment Company of Modesto California, if they didn't install the internal, larger, e-brake on it and then the owner removed it so it wouldn't hang up on anything. I was told this jeep was used on a ranch in Colorado. I suppose anything is possible. I realize that this would not be "period correct" for my 42, but again, I'm not planning on entering in any contests at this point.
Andy
Thanks, this is great info. I'd be curious on Tom W's response. I'm wondering if during the "reconditioning" process by Moore Equpiment Company of Modesto California, if they didn't install the internal, larger, e-brake on it and then the owner removed it so it wouldn't hang up on anything. I was told this jeep was used on a ranch in Colorado. I suppose anything is possible. I realize that this would not be "period correct" for my 42, but again, I'm not planning on entering in any contests at this point.
Andy
Andy Peitsch
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
For those of you lucky owners of "The Military Jeep" By Lawrence Nabholtz, the 1st Edition, Page 38, and Revised Edition Page 56 illustrate the late Parking Brake on a 1945 GPW. The Photo is from Lawrences 8X10 Archival Glossy WWII Collection that he used to sell copies of.
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
Hi Andy and others,
Ford records do not indicate that the GPW ever had the internal parking brake arrangement. Plans were in place to use the internal setup but GPW production ended prior to using the new brake setup.
The photo cited ( same photo in both books ) in the Nabholtz books is a poor sample to cite how a GPW was equipped when it left the assembly plant. This GPW ( DoD 07-02-45 ) is well used and may even be pictured during the Korean era rather than during WW2. Mr. Nabholtz got a great many MB / GPW details correct but some he did not and this is one of them.
Edit - Changed the word external to internal. Sorry for the typo and thanks to Luca for pointing the mistake.
Ford records do not indicate that the GPW ever had the internal parking brake arrangement. Plans were in place to use the internal setup but GPW production ended prior to using the new brake setup.
The photo cited ( same photo in both books ) in the Nabholtz books is a poor sample to cite how a GPW was equipped when it left the assembly plant. This GPW ( DoD 07-02-45 ) is well used and may even be pictured during the Korean era rather than during WW2. Mr. Nabholtz got a great many MB / GPW details correct but some he did not and this is one of them.
Edit - Changed the word external to internal. Sorry for the typo and thanks to Luca for pointing the mistake.
Last edited by Tom Wolboldt on Wed Sep 26, 2012 12:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
Hi Tom! Just to be sure of being on the same page, wouldn't be the later kind of parking brake which Ford did not use be called internal expanding, as opposed to the earlier kind usually referred to as external contracting?Tom wrote:Hi Andy and others,
Ford records do not indicate that the GPW ever had the external parking brake arrangement. Plans were in place to use the external setup but GPW production ended prior to using the new brake setup.
The photo cited ( same photo in both books ) in the Nabholtz books is a poor sample to cite how a GPW was equipped when it left the assembly plant. This GPW ( DoD 07-02-45 ) is well used and may even be pictured during the Korean era rather than during WW2. Mr. Nabholtz got a great many MB / GPW details correct but some he did not and this is one of them.
If so, maybe you switched the two definitions?
Friendly regards,Luca.
Luca
WillysMB#344142 6-19-44 Navy N.S.Blue Grey
45 Bantam T-3 #57248 1-10-45
42 Willys MB-T #13560 11-42
43 Willys MB-T # 25417 4-43
Way too many WWII military tools,hopefully thinning down,and way too many posts...
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WillysMB#344142 6-19-44 Navy N.S.Blue Grey
45 Bantam T-3 #57248 1-10-45
42 Willys MB-T #13560 11-42
43 Willys MB-T # 25417 4-43
Way too many WWII military tools,hopefully thinning down,and way too many posts...
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
Let us be precise and say Ford never changed from the Hand Brake FM-GPW-2598, WO-A-1008 (External Contracting Type) to Hand Brake FM-GPW-2598-B, WO-A-9333 (internal expanding type).
I have the changeover at MB-373337 on 9-21-44 but some were installed earlier than this. I'm still looking at documentation.
I have the changeover at MB-373337 on 9-21-44 but some were installed earlier than this. I'm still looking at documentation.
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Re: sept 44 willys mb internal or external parking brake?
_____________________________________________Tom wrote:Hi Andy and others,
Ford records do not indicate that the GPW ever had the internal parking brake arrangement. Plans were in place to use the internal setup but GPW production ended prior to using the new brake setup.
The photo cited ( same photo in both books ) in the Nabholtz books is a poor sample to cite how a GPW was equipped when it left the assembly plant. This GPW ( DoD 07-02-45 ) is well used and may even be pictured during the Korean era rather than during WW2. Mr. Nabholtz got a great many MB / GPW details correct but some he did not and this is one of them.
Edit - Changed the word external to internal. Sorry for the typo and thanks to Luca for pointing the mistake.
Tom, they did not have T-5's in Korea.
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